153. Important Answers to Important Questions

Part 1 - 4


December 10, 2017


http://omega77.tripod.com/importantanswerspt1.htm

 

 

Dear Sister _ _ _ _ _ _ _,

 

You asked about what I know about David Clayton. Below are links to articles I have written in the past that include David Clayton:

 

http://omega77.tripod.com/allerror.htm

 

http://omega77.tripod.com/davidclaytonholyspiritcritique.htm

 

I will make the Godhead very easy for you in ONE VERSE of Scripture, John 14:23.

 

In John 14:22, Jesus, while on earth, is speaking to Judas - the same as Thaddeus and Lebbeus, the brother of James, and author of what is called the epistle of Jude.

 

 Jhn 14:23  Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him. 

 

In John 14, we have three persons, to wit:

 

1. Jesus in His humanity is speaking to Judas (Thaddeus).

2. Jesus says that He and the Father will come unto us and make their abode with us.

3. It is the ONE ETERNAL SPIRIT of both Jesus and the Father that comes to us. The humanity of Jesus cannot come to us. Without these three persons there would have been NO ATONEMENT, NO DEATH OF THE TESTATOR to anything FOREVER.

 

You asked for an explanation of Revelation 7:9-17.

 

Rev. 14 and Rev. 17

 

I’m going to quote all the verses of the chapter for that will help in making my explanation clearer.

 

These verses from 1-8 describe 12,000 from each tribe that make up the 144,000. That is a separate view seen by John during the sealing of the 144,000 which occurs BEFORE the scene he sees in verses 9-17.

 

AFTER sealing the 144,000, which was BEFORE John sees the great multitude gathered before the throne, and before the Lamb, he sees the great multitude before the throne. All the saved go to heaven together. The 144,000 don’t precede the great multitude.

 

Any proper interpretation of Revelation 7, must include Revelation 14:1-4, which defines the 144,000, to wit:

 

And I looked, and, lo, a Lamb stood on the mount Sion, and with him an hundred forty and four thousand, having his Father's name written in their foreheads. 

Rev 14:2   And I heard a voice from heaven, as the voice of many waters, and as the voice of a great thunder: and I heard the voice of harpers harping with their harps: 

Rev 14:3   And they sung as it were a new song before the throne, and before the four beasts, and the elders: and no man could learn that song but the hundred and forty and four thousand, which were redeemed from the earth. 

Rev 14:4   These are they which were not defiled with women; for they are virgins. These are they which follow the Lamb whithersoever he goeth. These were redeemed from among men, being the firstfruits unto God and to the Lamb. 

Rev 14:5   And in their mouth was found no guile: for they are without fault before the throne of God. 

 

Characteristics of the 144,000 with Philadelphia:

 

Rev 3:10   Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. 

Rev 3:11   Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. 

Rev 3:12   Him that overcometh will I make a pillar in the temple of my God, and he shall go no more out: and I will write upon him the name of my God, and the name of the city of my God, [which is] new Jerusalem, which cometh down out of heaven from my God: and I will write upon him my new name.

 

·         They have the Father’s name written in their foreheads.

·         No man learns the song but the 144,000, which are redeemed from the earth—translated without seeing death.

·         They are not defiled with women (apostate churches).

·         They are virgins. In Isaiah 62:1-4, Zion is married. The Hebrew for the word virgin in verse 5, is bethulah, which mean a strictly pure virgin, as opposed to the ten virgins who are concubines.

·         THE 144,000 ARE FIRSTFRUITS. This proves that there are others, who are not FIRSTFRUITS.

·         They are WITHOUT FAULT. They have overcome in a greater degree, and that is why they are made PILLARS (PRIESTS) in the Temple. If all the great multitude were priests, who would they minister to?

·         In Revelation 3:10-12, it is Philadelphia who gets the name of God, New Jerusalem, written on them.

·         It is Philadelphia that is made a pillar (leaders) in the Temple of God on Mt. Zion in heaven.

·         Philadelphia is regenerated to be kept through the time of trouble, the hour of temptation which shall come UPON ALL THE WORLD.

·         The above items are not attributed to any of the other churches in Revelation chapters 2 and 3.

·         Ellen White says that only the 144,000 enter the Temple of God in heaven.

·         Rev. 3:12 says that Philadelphia is made a pillar in the Temple of God. That means “lesser priests,” while Christ is the high priest.

·         So only those of the great multitude who were Philadelphians are made leaders in the Temple,

 

Rev 7:1   And after these things I saw four angels standing on the four corners of the earth, holding the four winds of the earth, that the wind should not blow on the earth, nor on the sea, nor on any tree. 

 

Rev 7:2   And I saw another angel ascending from the east, having the seal of the living God: and he cried with a loud voice to the four angels, to whom it was given to hurt the earth and the sea, 

 

Rev 7:3   Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads. 

 

Rev 7:4   And I heard the number of them which were sealed: and there were sealed an hundred and forty and four thousand of all the tribes of the children of Israel. 

 

Rev 7:5   Of the tribe of Juda were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Reuben were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Gad were sealed twelve thousand. 

 

Rev 7:6   Of the tribe of Aser were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Nepthalim were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Manasses were sealed twelve thousand. 

 

Rev 7:7   Of the tribe of Simeon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Levi were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Issachar were sealed twelve thousand. 

 

Rev 7:8   Of the tribe of Zabulon were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Joseph were sealed twelve thousand. Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand. 

 

The time-frame of the above verses is the sealing of the 144,000 before the Time of Trouble, so they can receive the Holy Spirit to give the Loud Cry.

 

The time-frame of the following verses is in heaven, before the throne of God. John sees a great multitude, which no man could number. They all have white robes. Long ago I asked God for the answer to this riddle, which seems to contradict Rev. 14:1-4 and Revelation 3:10-12, as well as Ellen White. I was shown that they all have white robes, but the robes of the 144,000 are a more brilliant white with a sheen.

 

Dear Sister _ _ _ _ _ _ _, I don’t expect anyone to believe what the Lord showed me, but that being aside, there are huge contradictions in the Bible and the Spirit of Prophecy concerning the 144,000 as Philadelphians, if one interprets Revelation 7 in any other way than I am showing you dear sister. I pray that the Holy Spirit will show you this fact.

 

Let me paint a picture for you that the Lord just gave me in vision while I was writing this. He gave me another answer, to wit: In Rev. 7, verse 13, one of the elders asked John: “What are these which are arrayed in white robes? And whence came they? John replies: “These are they which came out of great tribulation.”

 

IMPORTANT QUESTION FOR ANYONE WHO BELIEVES THAT ALL THE SAVED ARE PART OF THE 144,000:

 

Do all who are saved come out of GREAT TRIBULATION? Of course not! Then John cannot possibly mean that all who have white robes are the 144,000! Thank you Lord for this revelation in vision.

 

If you will accept that irrefutable proof of what I am saying dear Sister, you will be on the right path, for NO ONE can say that all those with white robes come of out great tribulation. Some are in the grave during the tribulation and don’t come up out of the grave at the resurrection of the dead until Jesus comes. Those who have died without going through THE GREAT TRIBULATION OF JACOB’S GREAT TIME OF TROUBLE, don’t go through that trouble, yet the faithful during all history before THE GREAT TRIBULATION will be saved!

 

I asked for the Lord’s assistance in giving you the proper answer, AND HE SURELY OBLIGED! Thank you Lord Jesus, our precious Lord and Saviour!

 

Rev 7:9   After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; 

Rev 7:10   And cried with a loud voice, saying, Salvation to our God which sitteth upon the throne, and unto the Lamb.

Rev 7:11   And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God, 

Rev 7:12   Saying, Amen: Blessing, and glory, and wisdom, and thanksgiving, and honour, and power, and might, be unto our God for ever and ever. Amen. 

Rev 7:13   And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? 

Rev 7:14   And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 

Rev 7:15   Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. 

Rev 7:16   They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. 

Rev 7:17   For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes. 

 

Ellen White saw three groups in heaven:

"Nearest the throne are those who were once zealous in the cause of Satan, but who, plucked as brands from the burning, have followed their Saviour with deep, intense devotion. Next are those who perfected Christian characters in the midst of falsehood and infidelity, those who honored the law of God when the Christian world declared it void, and the millions, of all ages, who were martyred for their faith. And beyond is the "great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, . . . before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands." Revelation 7:9. Their warfare is ended, their victory won. They have run the race and reached the prize. The palm branch in their hands is a symbol of their triumph, the white robe an emblem of the spotless righteousness of Christ which now is theirs." E.G. White, The Great Controversy, p. 665.

Notice above that Ellen White was very aware that all who go to heaven have white robes, and palms in their hands. She is quoting Revelation 7:9.

There is further distinction of those who sit nearest the throne, and it is only natural that the bride of Jesus Christ sits nearest His throne, as His wife:

Until men co-operate with Christ, they are represented as being idle, so far as His business is concerned. They are doing nothing to promote the interests of the kingdom of God. Could the scenes of the judgment pass before them, they would see that they entertain erroneous ideas regarding that which the Lord values. Many who in this world are first, many who are looked upon as above others, will one day see that God estimates men according to their compassion, love, and self-denial. Those who help and bless their fellow-men, trying always to lift them up, are precious in God’s sight; for they follow the example of Him who went about doing good.” {AUCR January 15, 1904, par. 4}

 

It is such ones who will sit nearest to Christ on His throne. Here they gave others the preference, denying self. He who reads the heart, sees their excellence of character; and when He gathers His chosen ones into His kingdom, they will be given positions of honor; for they are worthy.” {AUCR January 15, 1904, par. 5}

 

God’s greatest blessings to you all on His Holy Sabbath day,

 

Ron

 

 

 

 

152. More Answers to More Questions

Part 2


December 9, 2017


http://omega77.tripod.com/moreanswerspt2.htm



 Dear Sister _ _ _ _ _ _ _,

 

I watched the video link you sent, by David Clayton, https://youtu.be/o7hBZ798IKc and I have a number of disagreements.

 

Regarding the Godhead, David says that Revelation teaches that only God the Father is seated on the throne, and that this is the greatest proof of his teaching on the Godhead—THAT THERE IS ONLY ONE PERSON WHO IS GOD IN THE HIGHEST SENSE, and that there are NOT three persons to the Godhead.

 

Ellen White said that Christ is God in the highest sense. Only one equal to God could be the Testator of the Everlasting Covenant. Clayton’s teaching on the Godhead is as antichrist as it can get. To remove the third person that resulted from the Incarnation, is to remove that sacrifice—thus there would be no atonement, and thus the entire Christian economy is swept away by such a teaching. How could God bless such a person with His truth?

 

Christ was God essentially, and in the highest sense. He was with God from all eternity, God over all, blessed forevermore.” {RH, April 5, 1906 par. 6}

 

The Lord Jesus Christ, the divine Son of God, existed from eternity, a distinct person, yet one with the Father.” {RH, April 5, 1906 par. 7}

 

 Clayton’s teaching that Revelation teaches that only God the Father sits on His throne, is a serious error for a teacher to make, especially one who professes to teach the Word of God. Notice the following verses from Hebrews:

 

Heb 8:1 Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens;

Heb 10:12 But this man, after he had offered one sacrifice for sins for ever, sat down on the right hand of God;

Heb 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

1Pe 3:22 Who is gone into heaven, and is on the right hand of God; angels and authorities and powers being made subject unto him.

Even in Revelation Chapter 7, verse 17 find Jesus in the midst of the throne.

Rev 7:17   For the Lamb which is in the midst of the throne shall feed them, and shall lead them unto living fountains of waters: and God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes. 

 

Heb 1:8 But unto the Son he saith, Thy throne, O God, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom.

 

David is so wrong on the Godhead. I spell that out much more in the links I sent to you yesterday.

 

I KNOW David Clayton is wrong on Revelation 7 depicting the great multitude as the 144,000 and vice versa. John saw the 144,000, and he numbered them, 12,000 of each tribe. He was specific. Ellen White said the 144,000 IN NUMBER.

 

But proof absolute that Clayton’s teaching that the great multitude in Revelation 7 is the same as the 144,000, is Ellen White’s following statement QUOTING REVELATION 7:9. Obviously, the first group nearest the throne is the bride, the 144,000, Then there are the martyrs of all ages. And beyond, is the great multitude which no man could number. But David does not believe Ellen White, because he does not believe her statements that there are three persons to the Godhead either.

 

Ellen White saw three groups in heaven:

"Nearest the throne are those who were once zealous in the cause of Satan, but who, plucked as brands from the burning, have followed their Saviour with deep, intense devotion. Next are those who perfected Christian characters in the midst of falsehood and infidelity, those who honored the law of God when the Christian world declared it void, and the millions, of all ages, who were martyred for their faith. And beyond is the "great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, . . . before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands." Revelation 7:9. Their warfare is ended, their victory won. They have run the race and reached the prize. The palm branch in their hands is a symbol of their triumph, the white robe an emblem of the spotless righteousness of Christ which now is theirs." E.G. White, The Great Controversy, p. 665.

Notice above that Ellen White was very aware that all who go to heaven have white robes, and palms in their hands. She is quoting Revelation 7:9.

 

The living saints, 144,000 in number, knew and understood the voice, while the wicked thought it was thunder and an earthquake. When God spoke the time, He poured upon us the Holy Ghost, and our faces began to light up and shine with the glory of God, as Moses’ did when he came down from Mount Sinai. {EW 14.1}

The 144,000 were all sealed and perfectly united. On their foreheads was written, God, New Jerusalem, and a glorious star containing Jesus’ new name. At our happy, holy state the wicked were enraged, and would rush violently up to lay hands on us to thrust us into prison, when we would stretch forth the hand in the name of the Lord, and they would fall helpless to the ground. Then it was that the synagogue of Satan knew that God had loved us who could wash one another’s feet and salute the brethren with a holy kiss, and they worshiped at our feet.” {EW 15.1}

 

The setting of Rev. 7, verses 9-17, is defined in verse 9. It is AFTER the redemption of all who are saved, and who are standing before the throne and before the Lamb. This includes ALL who are saved, not just the 144,000.

 

Rev 7:9  After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands; 

After that, he saw a great multitude, which no man could number. Ellen White settles the question on this matter. She saw all three groups and defined them. She saw them BEFORE THE THRONE AND THE LAMB.

 

Ellen White saw three groups in heaven:

"Nearest the throne are those who were once zealous in the cause of Satan, but who, plucked as brands from the burning, have followed their Saviour with deep, intense devotion. Next are those who perfected Christian characters in the midst of falsehood and infidelity, those who honored the law of God when the Christian world declared it void, and the millions, of all ages, who were martyred for their faith. And beyond is the "great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, . . . before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands." Revelation 7:9. Their warfare is ended, their victory won. They have run the race and reached the prize. The palm branch in their hands is a symbol of their triumph, the white robe an emblem of the spotless righteousness of Christ which now is theirs." E.G. White, The Great Controversy, p. 665.

Notice above that Ellen White was very aware that all who go to heaven have white robes, and palms in their hands. She is quoting Revelation 7:9.

 

All His blessings,

 

Ron






152. My Vision on More Answers Part 3


December 10, 2017


http://omega77.tripod.com/myvisionmoreanswerspt3.htm


In the early hours of the morning, December 10, 2017, the Lord was pleased to show me more means by which the 144,000 will be distinguished from the martyrs and the great multitude around the throne in heaven, in reference to Revelation, Chapter 7. Considering all the following features distinguishing the bride of Christ, the 144,000, it will be no problem to single them out in heaven from the group of martyrs with a red border on their garment and the great multitude.

The 144,000 will be nearest the throne and between them and the great multitude will be the martyrs with a red border on their robes. The white robes of the 144,000 are a brighter, purer white, which symbolizes their greater purity, in that they overcome sin in a greater measure, and they are not defiled with women (apostate churches). They are blameless. Rev. 14:1-4.

1.    Isaiah 62:1-5 describes the bride. It says that her righteousness will go forth as BRIGHTNESS, and the salvation thereof AS A LAMB THAT BURNETH.

2.    The 144,000 will have more stars in their crowns because of their greater works in gathering others into the garner of heaven. “Some crowns appeared heavy with stars, while others had but few. All were perfectly satisfied with their crowns. (See Ellen White’s first vision further down.)

3.    In verse 2 it says that the Gentiles shall see her righteousness, and all kings her glory, and that it is she who will be called by a New Name which is defined in Revelation 3:10-12 as New Jerusalem. In verse 3, it says the bride, the 144,000, will appear as A CROWN OF GLORY and A ROYAL DIADEM.

4.    In verse 5, the Hebrew word for virgin, is bethulah, which means strictly pure. (See Gesenius’ Hebrew--Chaldee Lexicon to the Old Testament), whereas the 10 virgins are concubines. Their robes will not be as pure in color and sheen of light.

5.    The bride will be nearest to Jesus, nearest the throne.

6.    The 144,000 will stand in a perfect square. (See quote in Ellen White’s vision further down).

7.    The 144,000 wear a mantle. (See Ellen White’s first vision further down.)

8.    The 144,000 will wear a royal diadem.

A diadem is a type of crown, specifically an ornamental headband worn by monarchs and others as a badge of royalty. ... A diadem is also a jewelled ornament in the shape of a half crown, worn by women and placed over the forehead (in this sense, also called tiara).”


       A Typical Diadem (Google the words: Royal Diadem).

Isa 62:1  For Zion's sake will I not hold my peace, and for Jerusalem's sake I will not rest, until the righteousness thereof go forth as brightness, and the salvation thereof as a lamp that burneth. 

Isa 62:2   And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness, and all kings thy glory: and thou shalt be called by a new name, which the mouth of the LORD shall name. 

Isa 62:3   Thou shalt also be a crown of glory in the hand of the LORD, and a royal diadem in the hand of thy God. 

Isa 62:4   Thou shalt no more be termed Forsaken; neither shall thy land any more be termed Desolate: but thou shalt be called Hephzibah, and thy land Beulah: for the LORD delighteth in thee, and thy land shall be married. 

Isa 62:5   For as a young man marrieth a virgin, so shall thy sons marry thee: and as the bridegroom rejoiceth over the bride, so shall thy God rejoice over thee. 


Early Writings: Ellen White’s First Vision

Page 13

My First Vision

 

[This view was given soon after the great Advent disappointment in 1844, and was first published in 1846. Only a few of the events of the future were seen at that time. Later views have been more full. See also appendix.]

As God has shown me the travels of the Advent

 

14

 

people to the Holy City and the rich reward to be given those who wait the return of their Lord from the wedding, it may be my duty to give you a short sketch of what God has revealed to me. The dear saints have many trials to pass through. But our light afflictions, which are but for a moment, will work for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory--while we look not at the things which are seen, for the things which are seen are temporal, but the things which are not seen are eternal. I have tried to bring back a good report and a few grapes from the heavenly Canaan, for which many would stone me, as the congregation bade stone Caleb and Joshua for their report. (Num. 14:10.) But I declare to you, my brethren and sisters in the Lord, it is a goodly land, and we are well able to go up and possess it. 

 

While I was praying at the family altar, the Holy Ghost fell upon me, and I seemed to be rising higher and higher, far above the dark world. I turned to look for the Advent people in the world, but could not find them, when a voice said to me, "Look again, and look a little higher." At this I raised my eyes, and saw a straight and narrow path, cast up high above the world. On this path the Advent people were traveling to the city, which was at the farther end of the path. They had a bright light set up behind them at the beginning of the path, which an angel told me was the midnight cry. This light shone all along the path and gave light for their feet so that they might not stumble. If they kept their eyes fixed on Jesus, who was just before them, leading them to the city, they were safe. But soon some grew weary, and said the city was a great way off, and they expected to have entered it before. Then Jesus would encourage

 

15

 

them by raising His glorious right arm, and from His arm came a light which waved over the Advent band, and they shouted, "Alleluia!" Others rashly denied the light behind them and said that it was not God that had led them out so far. The light behind them went out, leaving their feet in perfect darkness, and they stumbled and lost sight of the mark and of Jesus, and fell off the path down into the dark and wicked world below. Soon we [see appendix.] heard the voice of God like many waters, which gave us the day and hour of Jesus' coming. The living saints, 144,000 in number, knew and understood the voice, while the wicked thought it was thunder and an earthquake. When God spoke the time, He poured upon us the Holy Ghost, and our faces began to light up and shine with the glory of God, as Moses' did when he came down from Mount Sinai. 

 

The 144,000 were all sealed and perfectly united. On their foreheads was written, God, New Jerusalem, and a glorious star containing Jesus' new name. At our happy, holy state the wicked were enraged, and would rush violently up to lay hands on us to thrust us into prison, when we would stretch forth the hand in the name of the Lord, and they would fall helpless to the ground. Then it was that the synagogue of Satan knew that God had loved us who could wash one another's feet and salute the brethren with a holy kiss, and they worshiped at our feet. 

 

Note by Ron: Revelation 3:10-12 says that Philadelphia received the new name, God, New Jerusalem. End note.

 

Soon our eyes were drawn to the east, for a small black cloud had appeared, about half as large as a man's hand, which we all knew was the sign of the Son of man. We all in solemn silence gazed on the cloud as it drew nearer and became lighter, glorious, and still more glorious, till it was a great white cloud. The bottom appeared like fire; a rainbow was over the cloud, while around it were ten thousand angels,

 

16

 

singing a most lovely song; and upon it sat the Son of man. His hair was white and curly and lay on His shoulders; and upon His head were many crowns. His feet had the appearance of fire; in His right hand was a sharp sickle; in His left, a silver trumpet. His eyes were as a flame of fire, which searched His children through and through. Then all faces gathered paleness, and those that God had rejected gathered blackness. Then we all cried out, "Who shall be able to stand? Is my robe spotless?" Then the angels ceased to sing, and there was some time of awful silence, when Jesus spoke: "Those who have clean hands and pure hearts shall be able to stand; My grace is sufficient for you." At this our faces lighted up, and joy filled every heart. And the angels struck a note higher and sang again, while the cloud drew still nearer the earth. 

 

Then Jesus' silver trumpet sounded, as He descended on the cloud, wrapped in flames of fire. He gazed on the graves of the sleeping saints, then raised His eyes and hands to heaven, and cried, "Awake! awake! awake! ye that sleep in the dust, and arise." Then there was a mighty earthquake. The graves opened, and the dead came up clothed with immortality. The 144,000 shouted, "Alleluia!" as they recognized their friends who had been torn from them by death, and in the same moment we were changed and caught up together with them to meet the Lord in the air. 

 

We all entered the cloud together, and were seven days ascending to the sea of glass, when Jesus brought the crowns, and with His own right hand placed them on our heads. He gave us harps of gold and palms of victory. Here on the sea of glass the 144,000 stood in a perfect square. Some of them had very bright crowns, others not so bright. Some crowns appeared heavy with stars, while others had but few. All were perfectly satisfied with their crowns. And they were all

 

17

 

clothed with a glorious white mantle from their shoulders to their feet. Angels were all about us as we marched over the sea of glass to the gate of the city. Jesus raised His mighty, glorious arm, laid hold of the pearly gate, swung it back on its glittering hinges, and said to us, "You have washed your robes in My blood, stood stiffly for My truth, enter in." We all marched in and felt that we had a perfect right in the city. 

 

Here we saw the tree of life and the throne of God. Out of the throne came a pure river of water, and on either side of the river was the tree of life. On one side of the river was a trunk of a tree, and a trunk on the other side of the river, both of pure, transparent gold. At first I thought I saw two trees. I looked again, and saw that they were united at the top in one tree. So it was the tree of life on either side of the river of life. Its branches bowed to the place where we stood, and the fruit was glorious; it looked like gold mixed with silver. 

 

We all went under the tree and sat down to look at the glory of the place, when Brethren Fitch and Stockman, [See appendix.] who had preached the gospel of the kingdom, and whom God had laid in the grave to save them, came up to us and asked us what we had passed through while they were sleeping. We tried to call up our greatest trials, but they looked so small compared with the far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory that surrounded us that we could not speak them out, and we all cried out, "Alleluia, heaven is cheap enough!" and we touched our glorious harps and made heaven's arches ring. 

 

With Jesus at our head we all descended from the city down to this earth, on a great and mighty mountain, which could not bear Jesus up, and it parted asunder, and there was a mighty plain. Then we looked up

 

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and saw the great city, with twelve foundations, and twelve gates, three on each side, and an angel at each gate. We all cried out, "The city, the great city, it's coming, it's coming down from God out of heaven," and it came and settled on the place where we stood. Then we began to look at the glorious things outside of the city. There I saw most glorious houses, that had the appearance of silver, supported by four pillars set with pearls most glorious to behold. These were to be inhabited by the saints. In each was a golden shelf. I saw many of the saints go into the houses, take off their glittering crowns and lay them on the shelf, then go out into the field by the houses to do something with the earth; not as we have to do with the earth here; no, no. A glorious light shone all about their heads, and they were continually shouting and offering praises to God. 

 

I saw another field full of all kinds of flowers, and as I plucked them, I cried out, "They will never fade." Next I saw a field of tall grass, most glorious to behold; it was living green and had a reflection of silver and gold, as it waved proudly to the glory of King Jesus. Then we entered a field full of all kinds of beasts--the lion, the lamb, the leopard, and the wolf, all together in perfect union. We passed through the midst of them, and they followed on peaceably after. Then we entered a wood, not like the dark woods we have here; no, no; but light, and all over glorious; the branches of the trees moved to and fro, and we all cried out, "We will dwell safely in the wilderness and sleep in the woods." We passed through the woods, for we were on our way to Mount Zion. 

 

As we were traveling along, we met a company who also were gazing at the glories of the place. I noticed red as a border on their garments; their crowns were brilliant; their robes were pure white. As we greeted

 

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them, I asked Jesus who they were. He said they were martyrs that had been slain for Him. With them was an innumerable company of little ones; they also had a hem of red on their garments. Mount Zion was just before us, and on the mount was a glorious temple, and about it were seven other mountains, on which grew roses and lilies. And I saw the little ones climb, or, if they chose, use their little wings and fly, to the top of the mountains and pluck the never-fading flowers. There were all kinds of trees around the temple to beautify the place: the box, the pine, the fir, the oil, the myrtle, the pomegranate, and the fig tree bowed down with the weight of its timely figs--these made the place all over glorious. And as we were about to enter the holy temple, Jesus raised His lovely voice and said, "Only the 144,000 enter this place," and we shouted, "Alleluia." 

 

Note by Ron: In Revelation 3:10-12, Philadelphians are made pillars (priests/leaders) in the Temple in heaven. They are the lesser priests while Christ will be the High Priest. End note.

 

This temple was supported by seven pillars, all of transparent gold, set with pearls most glorious. The wonderful things I there saw I cannot describe. Oh, that I could talk in the language of Canaan, then could I tell a little of the glory of the better world. I saw there tables of stone in which the names of the 144,000 were engraved in letters of gold. After we beheld the glory of the temple, we went out, and Jesus left us and went to the city. Soon we heard His lovely voice again, saying, "Come, My people, you have come out of great tribulation, and done My will; suffered for Me; come in to supper, for I will gird Myself, and serve you." We shouted, "Alleluia! glory!" and entered into the city. And I saw a table of pure silver; it was many miles in length, yet our eyes could extend over it. I saw the fruit of the tree of life, the manna, almonds, figs, pomegranates, grapes, and many other kinds of fruit. I asked Jesus to let me eat of the fruit. He said, "Not now. Those who eat of the fruit of this

 

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land go back to earth no more. But in a little while, if faithful, you shall both eat of the fruit of the tree of life and drink of the water of the fountain." And He said, "You must go back to the earth again and relate to others what I have revealed to you." Then an angel bore me gently down to this dark world. Sometimes I think I can stay here no longer; all things of earth look so dreary. I feel very lonely here, for I have seen a better land. Oh, that I had wings like a dove, then would I fly away and be at rest!

 

Mantle http://www.dictionary.com/browse/mantle?s=t

/?mænt?l/

 

Noun

 

1. (archaic) a loose wrap or cloak

2. such a garment regarded as a symbol of someone's power or authority: he assumed his father's mantle

3. anything that covers completely or envelops: a mantle of snow


Conclusions:

In Revelation 7:13, when one of the elders asked: “What are these which are arrayed in white robes,” he was also referring to those who had far brighter, whiter robes; a royal diadem with stars; who stood in a perfect square nearest the throne of Christ. They were divided from the great multitude by the martyrs who had a red border on their robes. There was no problem for the elder to distinguish the 144,000 for all the others before the throne. This is what the Lord showed me this a.m.

Rev 7:13  And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? 

Rev 7:14  And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 

Rev 7:15   Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. 


http://omega77.tripod.com/importantanswerspt1.htm

http://omega77.tripod.com/moreanswerspt2.htm

http://omega77.tripod.com/myvisionmoreanswerspt3.htm

http://omega77.tripod.com/ellenwhiterev7pt4.htm


In the Name of the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob,


Ronald William Beaulieu







152. Ellen G. White on Revelation Chapter 7

Part 4 in the Series of Answering Important Questions


December 11, 2017


http://omega77.tripod.com/ellenwhiterev7pt4.htm


 

God gave the gift of prophecy to the church for the purpose of unity till He comes, to wit:

 

Eph 4:10   He that descended is the same also that ascended up far above all heavens, that he might fill all things.

Eph 4:11   And he gave some, apostles; and some, prophets; and some, evangelists; and some, pastors and teachers; 

Eph 4:12   For the perfecting of the saints, for the work of the ministry, for the edifying of the body of Christ: 

Eph 4:13   Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ: 

Eph 4:14   That we henceforth be no more children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive; 

Eph 4:15   But speaking the truth in love, may grow up into him in all things, which is the head, even Christ: 

Eph 4:16   From whom the whole body fitly joined together and compacted by that which every joint supplieth, according to the effectual working in the measure of every part, maketh increase of the body unto the edifying of itself in love.


Seventh-day Adventists understood, and today understand, Mrs. White’s ministry as the “messenger of the Lord” to be in fulfillment of the prophecy of (Revelation 12:17 and 19:10), that the remnant church “which keep the commandments of God” was to “have the testimony of Jesus”—“the spirit of prophecy.” They see in her work the gift of prophecy of which Paul speaks in (Ephesians 4:9-13 ) placed with other gifts in the church “for the perfecting of the saints” and “the edifying of the body of Christ: till we all come in the unity of the faith.” {1TT 17.2}


There are all manner of discombobulated personal opinions on the correct interpretation of Revelation, Chapter 7, which seems to confuse many professing Seventh-day Adventists concerning what the chapter is speaking of—the 144,000, or the great multitude, when it is speaking of both. The last word as to the correct meaning should include Ellen White’s following statement, which clearly defines three different groups in heaven, and she refers directly to the great multitude, and quotes Revelation 7:9. First I will give the bible verse and then Ellen White’s interpretation:


Rev 7:9  After this I beheld, and, lo, a great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, stood before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands;

John had just numbered the 144,000 in verses 1-8. AFTER THIS, he speaks of a great multitude that no man can number. Ellen White distinguishes that great multitude from the bride who is nearest the throne, and the martyrs who are nearer the throne than the great multitude.

Ellen White quotes the above verse in her following statement, proving that the great multitude is who John is speaking of. This is important, because some, like David Clayton, are teaching that John is speaking of only the 144,000, because all get white robes. That is not the case as I have proven in other documents on this issue.

 

"Nearest the throne are those who were once zealous in the cause of Satan, but who, plucked as brands from the burning, have followed their Saviour with deep, intense devotion. Next are those who perfected Christian characters in the midst of falsehood and infidelity, those who honored the law of God when the Christian world declared it void, and the millions, of all ages, who were martyred for their faith. And beyond is the "great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, . . . before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands." Revelation 7:9. Their warfare is ended, their victory won. They have run the race and reached the prize. The palm branch in their hands is a symbol of their triumph, the white robe an emblem of the spotless righteousness of Christ which now is theirs." E.G. White, The Great Controversy, p. 665.


1.    It is only reasonable to conclude that the bride is nearest the throne of the bridegroom, Jesus. The Lord has shown me this is the case. The bride has WHITE ONLY ROBES.


2.    Next in distance from the throne, are the martyrs, and Ellen White says that they have a red border on their robes. So the martyrs have white and red robes.


3.    And BEYOND, is the great multitude which no man could number. They have white robes as well, but they are at the greatest distance from the throne.


We are admonished to let every word have its place and interpret so that nothing contradicts. With this in mind, let us ascertain the location of the elders. We see from verse 11, that they are round about the throne with the angels. This is important, because in verse 13, it is an elder about the throne who asks the question: “What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they?” 


Rev 7:11  And all the angels stood round about the throne, and about the elders and the four beasts, and fell before the throne on their faces, and worshipped God, 


Rev 7:13 And one of the elders answered, saying unto me, What are these which are arrayed in white robes? and whence came they? 

Ellen White said that the 144,000 stood in a perfect square, and we found that they are nearest the throne. So it is reasonable to conclude that the elder who is “about the throne,” is asking about the 144,000 in white robes, because the martyrs with red bordered robes are in-between the 144,000 and the great multitude. It is clearly the 144,000 that the elder is enquiring about.


This is crucial because some, like David Clayton, are teaching that the only group mentioned in all of Revelation 7, is the 144,000, for the reason that all have white robes. This is a great misapprehension of Scripture and the Spirit of Prophecy. Ellen White’s statement above, and the context of Revelation 7:9-17, make it clear that all three groups of the saved are in heaven from the point of verse 9 and on.


Verse 14 makes it plain that the group the elder asks about is the 144,000, because they are the only ones who come out of the great tribulation.


Rev 7:14  And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. 

Verse 15 makes it clear that John is speaking of the 144,000, because Revelation 3:10-12, says that Philadelphians are made pillars (priests) in the Temple. The Philadelphians are the 144,000 because they are not faulted for anything. Also, they, as the bride of Isaiah 62:1-5, are a bethulah (strictly pure) bride, and in Isaiah 62:11, they lead out in giving the final Loud Cry. They are also depicted as the bride in Christ’s Object Lessons, pp. 405, 406, where it says that the voice of God, AND THE VOICE OF THE BRIDE, awakens the 10 virgins, and Matthew 25, says that all those virgins slumbered and slept.


Rev 7:15   Therefore are they before the throne of God, and serve him day and night in his temple: and he that sitteth on the throne shall dwell among them. 


Ellen White said that only the 144,000 go into the Temple on Mt. Zion. Early Writings, p. 19.


Verse 16, proves that John is referring to the 144,000, because it says they would hunger no more, neither thirst any more, neither shall the sun light on them nor any head. This is reference to the 4th plague that the 144,000 went through.

Rev 7:16   They shall hunger no more, neither thirst any more; neither shall the sun light on them, nor any heat. 

Rev 16:8  And the fourth angel poured out his vial upon the sun; and power was given unto him to scorch men with fire. 

Rev 16:9   And men were scorched with great heat, and blasphemed the name of God, which hath power over these plagues: and they repented not to give him glory.


All this reference to the 144,000, does not exclude the great multitude positioned in the third tier from the throne in heaven, because the 144,000 don’t ascend to heaven without the rest of the saved. As Ellen White says in DIRECT REFERENCE TO REV. 7: 9, John is ALSO speaking of the great multitude. They all have white robes, but the 144,000 are the closest in proximity to the elder who asks about those immediately in his presence about the throne who are clothed in white robes. With the martyrs and their white robes with red borders between the elder and the great multitude, this is like a dividing-line distinction between the 144,000 and the great multitude who are stationed at a greater distance from him.

 

"Nearest the throne are those who were once zealous in the cause of Satan, but who, plucked as brands from the burning, have followed their Saviour with deep, intense devotion. Next are those who perfected Christian characters in the midst of falsehood and infidelity, those who honored the law of God when the Christian world declared it void, and the millions, of all ages, who were martyred for their faith. And beyond is the "great multitude, which no man could number, of all nations, and kindreds, and people, and tongues, . . . before the throne, and before the Lamb, clothed with white robes, and palms in their hands." Revelation 7:9. Their warfare is ended, their victory won. They have run the race and reached the prize. The palm branch in their hands is a symbol of their triumph, the white robe an emblem of the spotless righteousness of Christ which now is theirs." E.G. White, The Great Controversy, p. 665.

 

All who accept Ellen White’s testimony as the promised gift of prophecy to the church for the purpose of unity of the saints, will accept her interpretation (above), that John was speaking of BOTH the 144,000 and the great multitude in Revelation, Chapter 7. Ellen White spoke of the 144,000 being in PERFECT UNITY, and the only way this is achieved is by the gift of prophecy to the church which was given for the distinct purpose of unity till He comes. No honest person who desire to be part of the 144,000, can interpret Revelation 7, as saying that it refers ONLY to the 144,000.


Links to all parts in this series:

http://omega77.tripod.com/importantanswerspt1.htm

http://omega77.tripod.com/moreanswerspt2.htm

http://omega77.tripod.com/myvisionmoreanswerspt3.htm

http://omega77.tripod.com/ellenwhiterev7pt4.htm


~rwb

 




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